Ok, I get it Paul. I was under the impression that your base lines up with where the hair starts. You actually have a gap of shaved hair between the end of the base and your growing hair starts. I thought the hair you had gave you a marker guide to where to apply your adhesive, but I guess you go above it.

So basically I can leave a tiny bit of my own hair in the back, but I have to make sure that the attachment point is higher up just below the occipital bone, and that the hairpiece hair is long enough to extend a little beyond the end of my own hair in the back

Paul, do you attach from the back to the front or front to back? Just wondering your method for getting a relatively wrinkle-free attachment.

Hi expriest....the pics may cause a bit of confusion in that [ naturally] you`d think I`m `working off` the hair start-point/line......I`m not . I totally ignored the growing hair when making the template and simply located the occipital bone and then came down below it to where I felt the perimeter would `sit` without too much skin- movement,not too far down but enough so that the system hair wouldn`t be too long and thus giving a `wiggy`look....I guess some guys like their hair to be very long normally , almost down to the base of the neck...that wouldn`t suit me at all.....it`s a matter of what style an individual likes but in my opinion, for the short-ish style I wear, having [proportionately] a little `length`at the back is fine, but not too long....a bit of a balancing act. When I was making the template, I was a topper-wearer and because my growing hair was/is so thin, I had to keep it shorter than where it is now in order to disguise the difference in density[blend] with the topper density [it really was too short /was a bit `up my neck` ] so I just totally ignored the growing hair when making the template....when the Fullcap arrived, I attached as normal and over the next few weeks I allowed the hair to grow down until IT met the system hair tips..NOT the other way around. The reason there`s a small gap there now between the black line and where the growing hair starts is simply because I was using an electric clipper thing a few days ago and went down a bit far with it...... If you get French lace, my experience of it is it`s a bit more ` rigid`than Swiss and less inclined to wrinkle.... I know JRob attaches his back bit first and works forward.....I do the opposite .....I`m so used to where my front attachment points are, I simply place tapes onto the skin first , then peel back a little `start`point/corner of the backing strip on each, sit/position the system so it`s sitting correctly at the front hairline point, then I peel off the backing tape there, attach, then each side[burn] flap and finally the strip at the back...but that`s just me...each person finds their own way of doing things. Honestly ...you don`t have to be spot-on to the nearest millimeter with it....as long as it`s not obviously too far forward / encroaching onto the actual forehead, or obviously too far back you`ll be fine....you`ll get so used to it after a few times you won`t even think about it. Finally, just locate your occipital bone, then come down to the little `hollow`below it...... have a look in a mirror and you`ll see that it`s probably not all that `far`from there to the tips of your hair as such....as a guide, I`d aim for not having more than 1.5 inches from the perimeter edge to the tips of the hair if possible ...... don`t let you present growing hair `dazzle`you at the back.....you may have let it grow down a bit lately and maybe it might need a little trim to get it to how you normally wear it ---- just aim to have your system looking like your own hair was when you had all your own hair, so not half way up the back of your head nor almost sitting on the shoulders ! If your present hair-length is exactly `right`, well your system hair shouldn`t be longer nor shorter but sit exactly `over`it...... it can be a little tricky and you`ll never be 100% sure until your system arrives, but sit your template on , have a good overall look and see how it `behaves`at the back when you incline the head forward/back... I assume you wear your hair styled in a kind of similar style to myself? I`d only order 4 inch length....I find that`s best for both me and the stylist...saves time at the cut-in and I can see what I`m doing when attaching at the salon......the younger guys can and do wear their hair quite long/flowing and that `s fine...at my age, the shorter way I wear it means 4 inch on my specs is more than enough.....the hair is just less than 1.5 inches at the nape when cut-in..why would I want 6 inches there and over 4 inches having to be cut off and end up on the floor? Only making more work for the stylist, adding to the time taken and the charge !! Keep it simple ! Totally `forget`/ignore your growing hair when template-making for a Fullcap .... imagine and replicate your hair as it was when you had a full head of hair and then `play`with/integrate the bit of underlying growing hair when your system is delivered --NOT the other way around ! Also have your perimeter a bit above your ears and not sitting onto them as it will `annoy`you /cause irritation... I have a gap of 1/4 of an inch there....Paul.

Thanks, Paul. I whipped this up last night. I have time to make another try today if necessary. Can you see anything that might need tweaking? Are the sideburns too short? I was thinking they could stand to be a bit lower, I don't know. Anything else catch your eye?

Re: the nape. I think I understand now and I will trim this a bit if it seems too low. I'll try moving my head around to see if it gets caught in any skin wrinkles. But I understand that you're saying just go below that bone so I don't have attachment issues and then have the hairpiece hair length to match where my own hair is now basically.

My main concern was a mismatch between the hairpiece density/hair and my own. It's so obvious when one stops and the other begins and there's no way to blend, the hair is just too different. But if this hairpiece hair is sitting on top of my hair it shouldn't be an issue (like in the nap area). Thanks

Now expriest...don`t take these literally now and please excuse the shaky line...hard to `draw` with the little touch pad on a laptop. I see your hair is on the long side at the back..probably further down from the occipital bone and the attachment area just under it, than mine is.... my suggestion is to trim your own hair back up just slightly, and shave/ `tidy`the neck area... just a little ..this will mean a `tidy`line. Pictures can be deceptive so I`m not sure exactly how far up your attachment point will be from the hair tips.... as I said earlier, I find the shorter the hair length from the perimeter to the tips the better it sits in nice and snug against the skin...longer hair can tend to just `hang`there and look a bit wiggy......just aim for a happy medium between where your attachment-point will be and the final ,styled hair-length. You have a bare-skin area just behind the ears..I`d suggest `filling`that in a bit as shown......I`d also bring the perimeter down a little more just above the ear.... a gap is good/advised but you`re a little too high...... I think JRob advises keeping /utilising the bit of facial hair just down where the jaw-stubble grows....I think your [growing]sideburns are long enough to give a nice `blend` and `soften`the look where the system hair meets it/lies onto the area in front of the ears. You can easily add a bit of material onto the template as it is... a roll of wide sellotape easily helps add more material while giving strength/rigidity to the template. My line running back behind the ear in pic 2 is not `to scale`or anything ....I was just trying to show a suggested `extra`area to give you more of a snug coverage..... I realise you`re probably used to that `bare`area there --but if you are going to bring your flaps down a bit more as you suggested [and I agree/have drawn the line] the hair will be `down`at the front there in front of the ear but will be `high`on your head at the sides as you go back behind the ear if you don`t bring the perimeter down a bit as shown. Hope I`m making sense and not confusing you...... that`s just my suggestion anyway..it`s not cast in stone ..use your own judgement also . Paul.

Paul, thank you. While you were doing that I made another template. Pics attached. I had a feeling you were going to make some suggestions on the side burn/ear area so I went ahead and got started on a new template. Can you tell me if these are better and any minor tweaks that might be made before I send it off tomorrow?

Are you saying that I should not have any of my own hair at all around my ears?

Also, re: the back: you'll see a pic that shows my finger for scale. It's probably around 2 inches at most. Even still, it's still a lot of my own hair. I would love to cut that down more but I'm worried about having problems with the base being on skin that is prone to wrinkling. On these pics the template is just under occipital bone. The attachment spot seems perfect, no wrinkling when I move my head around, but I would still like to go lower if I can. I hate my hair and the less of it the better, but I just don't know if the trade off is worth it.

As always, thanks for all your help on these forums. You rock.

Yeah that template is quite good now ....you`ve tidied up the flaps and your temples are looking good there too. Don`t be afraid to come down a bit more at the back...in the attached pic, you could trim your growing hair back as shown.....then bring [`stretch`] your perimeter down just a bit more ... as long as you don`t come down to where the yellow x marks are, you shouldn`t have any undue issues with your bond there... in relation to the ears ..I was just saying that you have an area of skin there where hair obviously doesn`t grow.....now is your opportunity too `fill`that in a bit... and have a nice gentle/gradual sweep back to the back / nape area as shown . In pic 2 there [green line] I reckon the gap between the template edge and the green line to be approx. 1/4 of an inch or so...yes it will bring you down a little bit away from the occipital bone area, but not far enough down to cause major bond-issues [mark a few arrows like the red ones onto the template there too]. If you notice from the top of the ear to where it turns to go across the back, it`s `following ` the edge of the growing hair---the system hair will lie nicely over the bit of growing hair there and it will look the same as when you had a full head of hair....... just draw arrows onto the template. Might be a good idea to enclose a few pics of your remaining hair to show the factory the way it lies so they can make your new system look the same.Just having another look at hte 2 pics there now.... I`d say the green line from the top of the ear backwards would give your the best coverage and `look`---the blue line in pic 1 might leave you a bit `short`of coverage.... it can be a little tricky on your first Fullcap....you`ll learn things now and when you get the system you`ll learn other things but shouldn`t need any drastic tweaking I`d say....... just get a nice age-appropriate density. I think I`ll go 65% at the back and top next time, 55% at the sides and possibly 70% for that last inch at the back just above the nape to give it `body`there and help hold the hair in /stop it curling ..as long as they ventilate it in tight and down , it should be fine. Hope that sorts you out now. By the way, those densities are just me thinking aloud for me..... I was just `bouncing`them off you as food for thought....bye for now, Paul.