First Piece just cut in, need help!! (photos)

First Piece just cut in, need help!! (photos) - Printable Version

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First Piece just cut in, need help!! (photos) - NoHairNoFair - 09-12-2014

Well I have some mixed emotions right now. First the good, I look way better than I did before. I'm 21 and lost a lot of hair and this has restored the youthfulness on the top of my head. Density, color match, texture, curl are all pretty spot on. I went to a hair system stylist that is recommended on this forum, Didi in NYC. That all being said, I have some concerns that are driving me nuts right now!
1) I can clearly see white glue on the ENTIRE hairline. Underneath it, behind it, everywhere! Is this not supposed to dry clear?
2) The lace is not disappearing against my skin. It's very white from the glue.
3) The lace has already starting lifting from the hairline. It hasn't been more than a few hours since it was attached.
4) I think I possibly made a critical mistake with the template. The hairline is very straight, very square, and very low. No natural recession. I feel like it surpassed my scalp skin onto my forehead skin where hair is not supposed to grow. I made the template myself btw, and never had any experience before.
5) To add insult to injury, the stylist mentioned she was positioning the system a little lower than where my natural hair starts. Her reasoning behind this was that hair growing from my scalp would interfere with the attachment. So the hairline is even lower than where the template intended. I have the hairline of a monkey right now!
6) It doesn't exactly look like a wig, but it looks pretty wiggy right now. I think with the combination of 4,5, the non-graduated specification I requested, the fact that it's new, and the hair cut itself(very short on the sides, 3-4 inches on top) all contribute to this.
7) I can feel a thin piece of the edge of the lace sticking out on basically the entire perimeter. The attachment was glue at the front, and tape around the sides. Should I say goodbye to girls touching my hair, or is it possible to make it undetectable to the touch? I specified an all french lace on my order.

She also mentioned during the cut-in that I should keep my hairline and place the system behind it, but obviously I didn't listen at the time since my hair is thinning at the hairline as well, but that might've worked out for the better. So I'm kinda thrilled, but also kinda hopeless right now. Please help a kid in need.

RE: First Piece just cut in, need help!! - lovehair - 09-12-2014

it would be great if you could post some pics of the system attached, as well as without the system so that we can see the quality of the bio hairline you are keeping....
as far as the white line....chances are she didn't allow the glue dry completely clear in between each coat and by laying one coat on top of the other it never got a chance to, this would also be why its lifting already...
personally positioning it lower than where it should be is a big no no....
concerning the edges....when you use tape it has to be done meticulously around the perimeter...when i do mine (using super tape) i make each piece meet end to end and it is exactly to the edge of the system... around the curved parts i trim the ends so that they butt up against the previous piece of tape....for a visual think of the way the corners of a picture frame meet. they are cut on an angle. of course i'm not doing it at a 90 degree angle because of curves, just trying to give you an idea of what i do...
it takes quite a bit of time but the edges are fairly undetectable, as undetectable as it can be with super tape which is a bit thick. but still one would have to really dig around to feel it.

its been my experience that when you go in for an attachment they are not as meticulous as they should be. i guess because its time consuming. they don't allow the glue time to cure and are not going for perfection. heck one time i had a tape attachment for the sides and back and the guy used 4 or 5 pieces that did not go completely around. there were big gaps between each piece of tape. not only that but it was so poorly done that when i got home i was able to effortlessly remove it!
this same person globbed glue along the hairline actually lifting the front edge to shove it underneath and pressed down! it wasnt until i left and ran my fingers along the hairline that i realized he had also left around a 1/4 inch of lace at the front!

regarding placing the system behind your natural hairline....it depends on its density and the style you are going for...if your hairline is thinnish it may not blended so well. you may see the system through it especially because its not graduated.

this is your first piece and you cant expect perfection...that sucks, i know.....
anyhow post some pics in the way i suggested above (wearing and not wearing) block out your face if you wish....then we can help you sort this out as best as possible.....afterward i would contact didi and let her know your dissatisfaction and hopefully she will rectify it

RE: First Piece just cut in, need help!! - NoHairNoFair - 09-12-2014

I actually don't even have any supplies right now to detach/attach a piece. I thought she sold some, but I'll have to order online I guess. I'm seeing her next week for detach/attach service, and an adjustment to the hair line and a new template.
These two pics were a few months ago with short hair, I know you can't see the front of the hairline that well but this is the most recent.
[Image: 34g6cuf.png]

These two pics were about two years ago with hair a little bit longer. I was already considering a piece when I took these, and actually posted them in a thread. I doubt I lost that much more hair between then and now.
[Image: 2vj3giv.jpg]

Here's another from February. Where the sides are longer than the top so it probably looks less dense then it really is.
[Image: 3039rax.png]

I know it doesn't look like I'm that bald btw, but trust me I'm pretty bald if you saw the top of my head in real life.

And here is the piece:
[Image: r0uv76.jpg]

The hairline of the piece doesn't look that terrible on the photo but in real life it's a different story. If it means anything, Didi said that I had a great natural hairline and other clients would've thought I was crazy to get rid of it.

RE: First Piece just cut in, need help!! - Minneapolis - 09-12-2014

French lace is thick- chances are high, that it just doesn't disappear. Next time order Swiss Lace (if you wanna go for lace).

I am wearing French lace (stock unit) right now and it lifts. That's normal; my second hairdresser said that is one of the reasons she doesn't sell laces.

And yes! You made a terrible mistake with your template by doing it YOURSELF. NEVER EVER do it yourself; a hairdresser always does it better (let's hope my hairdresser did it right; I will find out soon with my first custom unit...). Exceptions prove the rule, of course.

RE: First Piece just cut in, need help!! (photos) - AmericanJambo - 09-13-2014

I have to disagree with you Minneapolis. My first piece was a French lace front and it disappeared almost perfectly into 3 layers of ORWG. Only if you were to shine a very strong light directly downward would you be able to see the lace. That being said though, I did switch to Swiss and it is completely undetectable now. But, what I really disagree with is your statement that a hairdresser should do your template. I did my own template and my hairline is perfect. You can see by all the pictures I've posted, including a very very close close-up picture, that it's spot on. MANY of the people on this forum do their own templates and they come out exceptionally well. The best thing to do is make a template and then post pictures of it and people can advise corrections and tweaks to it.

Now, NoHairNoFair, you made a couple newbie mistakes. No big deal, you'll get it sorted out. That's what we're here for on this forum. Your biggest mistake was not having all your supplies prior to getting your piece cut in. I bought a years worth of glue, lace release, and Pure solvent remover, plus some 99% isopropyl alcohol before I got my first piece cut in. You want to make sure you have ALL your supplies in order before you take the plunge. Make sure you always have AT LEAST one back up of each supply that you use. NEVER let yourself get down to using that last bottle of something before you have another, either on hand or at least on the way. You also want to make sure that you have a backup piece as well. You don't want to be stuck with only one piece, especially as you start out.

As for the piece you have now, you can make some corrections to it. First, if you shave your hairline smooth and detach at least once a week, you'll have no problem wearing your piece where you want it to be. Second, you can make adjustments to the piece itself. You can adjust the hairline so that it has more of a curve. Just make sure you use very sharp scissors and cut only a little at a time and then place it on your head to see if you need a little more arch. Then you can get precision tweezers and pluck some of the hairs to thin the hairline a little to graduate it. Just go sow and be careful and you should be good to go. Wash your piece a couple of times, but make sure you're gentle with it, and it should settle down a bit and look less wiggy. I wash my piece only twice a week and never on my head. I use a wax for styling which works great for me. I just spritz a little water on it in the morning to reactive the wax, put a tiny bit more in and then a very light spritz of alcohol free finishing spray and I'm good to go.

I would make a new template immediately and get another piece ordered. Post pictures of your template on your head and we can give you some tips on what adjustments to make. And this time, I would highly recommend getting a graduated hairline. It's only a 5% difference but it makes a big difference in the appearance of the hairline. You can do like I do and only get 1/4" graduation instead of the standard 1/2" graduation. For me, it mimics the hairline that I had when I was in my 20s. Now that's not for everyone but it works great for me because I don't look anywhere near 38. Everyone thinks I'm in my late 20s. Since you're only 21 I think that the 1/4" graduated hairline would work great for you.

RE: First Piece just cut in, need help!! (photos) - Paul In Ireland - 09-13-2014

I think everything AmericanJambo said is good / I agree with ..only major ``caution`` is relating to cutting the lace with a scissors...... don`t do it !
If anyone wants/ needs to trim or cut some lace off a system, they should use a small sharp blade, such as a hobby / craft knife ..turn the system upside-down, and draw the blade across the lace ...do NOT press it down through the lace or you`ll slice through hairs which you want /need to keep ..... just apply a little light pressure as you draw the blade across the lace towards you and the lace will separate neatly, leaving the hair on the base intact...
A non-graduated hairline can really cause issues...younger guys can often get away with wearing them [ I know you`re young] ....it`s possible in your case that graduated would have been better to order...you can carefully thin it a bit by applying small dabs of hair-removal cream [ Nair] carefully to the knots.....you need to proceed very carefully and slowly with this if you decide to do it...... you just dab on tiny ` dots` of it , here and there, [the tip of a cotton-bud from which you`ve removed the cotton is ideal for it] allow it a few minutes to work and then rinse it out .... you may not see much shedding out immediately---- more will shed out in the next few days so if you decide to do this, do it very slowly i.e. over a week or so.... all systems have this ` bounce` in them and are very very ` lively` ...once you`ve slept with it on your head and washed it a few times it`ll begin to settle down .... from what I can see it isn`t as ` bad` as you imagine ..you`re naturally going to be SO self-conscious of it now --it`s your first ever system and first time wearing ---it`s a big psychological step to take.... it takes a lot of ` adjusting` , and as one of the guys said above, it rarely goes without a hitch !
You should go back to her and make your concerns known , as has been suggested.....kind regards !

RE: First Piece just cut in, need help!! (photos) - NoHairNoFair - 09-13-2014

Thanks for the advice guys.
I spoke with Didi on the phone, she says the glue didn't dry properly. She noticed me sweating during the cut in, and I probably sweated a lot more on the way back in the subway.

I went from a having a forehead to a threehead(three fingers between eyebrows and hairline). I can definitely feel some of the system is positioned below my scalp skin on to my forehead skin when I raise my eyebrows.

My natural hairline also had a curve/arch as it went upwards towards the sides. This is more a straight line going across my skull. It's also likely this is a non graduated hairline since I specified that in the comments of the order. I feel like even though I'm 21, the non graduated hairline, it's location, and shape, is something that would look natural only on someone with perfect full dense temples. I've seen people with temple hair like that, even on people much older than me, and those are the only people who naturally have low, straight, squarish, very dense hairlines to accommodate those temples. I on the other hand have recession, graduation, lower density on my temples, so regardless of my age it just looks off. I miss my old hairline.

Didi said she is willing to make a template for me. I would probably be better off letting her get that crucial part of the system done right? And is keeping some of my natural hairline and placing the system behind it a worthwhile option for me to consider? My hairline wasn't even that recessed, it was just thinning out. I would definitely get a graduated hairline on the system for that. I imagine lace hidden behind natural hair would look the most natural right?

RE: First Piece just cut in, need help!! (photos) - Paul In Ireland - 09-13-2014

Certainly discuss it with her..go see her... yes it is an option if you have a reasonably good hairline, to sit a system just behind it ..obviously the template needs to me designed to allow for that ....
Sweating during a bonding is never good ---obviously you`d be inclined to sweat whilst undergoing the whole thing . and a subway train is never the coolest place to be immediately after it .... to be honest, when applying glues, each [thin] coat need to be applied and at least 15 minutes to elapse between coats.... a lace system should never ever be pushed down onto ` wet` glue ......each coat should be allowed to ` cure` and change from white to clear..... profuse sweating during this time will have adverse consequences for your bond.

RE: First Piece just cut in, need help!! (photos) - NoHairNoFair - 09-13-2014

It was actually her idea to do that. And I was thinking why in the hell would one want that, the system might look weird sitting behind a thinning hairline. But I guess she might've known whether or not I could've pulled it off in the first place, better than I did at least. I talked to her on the phone about that, and she said it's possible. But idk how I'm grow 3+ inches of hair at the hairline with the system on top of it already. Or even with the system behind the growing hair without it looking weird.

RE: First Piece just cut in, need help!! (photos) - Paul In Ireland - 09-13-2014

You should immediately order all your supplies ---- anyone who`s waiting on their first system should have everything to hand, in the line of supplies, so you`re ready to go....... a selection of tapes, at least one or two glues and vitally, Lace-release, Glue -melter [such as ` Pure`] for dealing with residues on base/scalp, and I`d recommend a citrus-based Solvent such as De-solv-it /Goo -gone/ C-22 for really stubborn residues...... a system-specific shampoo and conditioner and a leave-in conditioner with sunscreen in it such as ``PPI Enhance`` .......not all tapes /glues work the same for everybody--it`s trial and error at the start until you settle on the ones you can best ` get on` with. A thinning-scissors [for minor adjustments] in your order is a great tool to have in any wearers supplies cabinet too !
Going back to your present situation and your trip to see her next week....... I have no issue with her or any other stylist etc. but I would like to say this: You made your own template, as most of us do ... we often don`t get it spot-on first time ..... we often need to re-make one for subsequent orders.....just because you feel the shape of the front there needs to be adjusted, doesn`t mean you can`t just do it yourself.....it just takes a bit of time and effort...your [or anyone else`s ] very first attempt, often needs to be ` tweaked` on your next order------- a first-time system is often a ` starting-point`... it`s part of this whole process of wearing ...you`ll learn very fast what looks ok or what may need to be adjusted....... my main point is this ------ you go to a stylist for a cut-in...you pay for that service [often quite a lot of money !!]...certainly you can accept advice from that person, whomever it happens to be, however, ultimately it`s YOUR decision on what to wear.....if you feel that your front hairline [your own hair] is not ` strong` enough to support a system sitting immediately behind it, just shave it off and wear a [normal] graduated system....... remember it`s YOU who`ll be walking around wearing it, and not the stylist !!! That goes for anyone reading this and thinking of wearing ........ go with what you feel is right for you..by all means listen to advice /tips.....but go with your gut-instinct. When my hair was getting really thin at the sides and back [in my topper days and going to these ` hair clubs` ] I said I was thinking of going Fullcap and they were saying all kinds of ` negative` things to me about Fullcaps..... like it was literally a case of I`d be walking into a mine field........ I decided I had no choice as I lost patience with trying to get a topper to blend in properly onto very thin hair ... I took the plunge with a fullcap..... I have NO regrets !!
I think you can get her to thin out the hair a bit with a thinning scissors....not heavily, but it can be tweaked a bit so you`re not so conscious of the density....... I think you should bring a tube of `Got2b` glued spiking glue with you ....when she debonds your system and cleans it, just use that to re-bond it....it`s much faster than the glue she applied last week and no visible marks for when you are heading home....I think that`s really awful that you were so self-conscious on that journey ....quite frankly I`m totally bemused as to why proper time wasn`t allowed for the layers of glue to dry correctly before the system was placed on your head ..you shouldn`t be coming out of any salon with visible white lines /marks !!! The beauty of Got2b is you can easily just hop into the shower at home and remove the system if you feel it`s not on / positioned correctly [and you can make a new template whilst it`s off your head] ...you can also easily re-bond it yourself and no white marks/visibility...... or you can just re-bond using tapes ...at least you`re in the privacy of your home and can take your time....Don`t be phased by this ... many of us go through similar things at the start but remember......you`re the ` boss` ---it`s what YOU feel is correct for you is the way to go..... if you feel the existing hairline [growing hair] is best removed....just tell her you don`t want to incorporate it !!
I know this is all new to you and you can feel a bit ` at sea` and think `` oh she/he knows best`` so I`ll do what they tell me ....... that`s often a big mistake..have a good think about it and do what you feel is right for you! Regards for now.